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The question of "mates"

 
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MaryZg
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PostPosted: Tue Dec 13, 2011 4:22 am    Post subject: The question of "mates" Reply with quote

As all of you here, I've read plenty of B/A stories. In those stories the word/term "mates" features quite often.
Now, I'm writing a story of my own, and have decided to work through this issue in my story. Not just use the word "mates" but use the concept as a plot device.
I'm fascinated by the possible phisiology/biology of vampires, and "mating" is, for me, a part of this, maybe integral one. Since that phisiology is never explored in the canon, it's certainly open for discussion, and obviously there are many ways I can do this.
I've decided to give it both a ritualistic aspect (magic) and an instinctual quality (phisiology of monogamous pairings in the animal kingdom). I also tied it to the famous bite from season 3, and decided that, to complete the ritual, Buffy has to take Angel's blood too. She'll do this in my story at one point, and they will finally be joined as mates should.
But I need to develop the idea into futher detail, and seeing how there are many quality writers hanging here, I thought the best would be to ask what you thought about the whole thing.
I need your wisdom, knowledge and advice, fellow shippers Smile
Is it even worth working on?
Would you believe it if you saw it in a story?
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The Librarian
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PostPosted: Tue Dec 13, 2011 11:26 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Sounds interesting. I look forward to seeing what you make of it.

By the way, it's physiology. Wink

If you would like writing tips and prompts, have you yet found one of Dark Star's other sites? Writer's Toybox?

If not, it's here:

http://writers-toybox.livejournal.com/

Jo
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MaryZg
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PostPosted: Tue Dec 13, 2011 2:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

My story is almost finished. And it's huge, over 140000 words in 28 chapters, for now.
But when you work on something in a field so well known and explored, thought about and written in, it's very scary and easy to make a mistake.
I'm currently sort of redeveloping the original idea, so that it works better, and I'm worried that the very idea is so overused in the fanon as to become empty of all meaning. I sort of wanted to infuse it with a new nuance, to give it weight it should have, since it is a common place of fanon.
Glad to hear it's still interesting Smile

Of course, to really be able to judge the merits of my idea, you'd have to read at least a bit of my story. Cause it's always ultimately the matter of how, and not the what when it comes to writing. But the story is so long, and I'm not sure how to present this one thing efectively without telling the whole story or even worse, taking the thing out of context and giving you just the parts that directly deal with the issue.

About prompts - sure, I've found the Toybox, and many other things during my search for B/A fics. But honestly, I don't know what I'd do with prompts. I'm so new at this Embarassed
And writing fiction is a bitch (excuse my French...)
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sybil
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PostPosted: Tue Dec 13, 2011 3:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think you could approach the Buffy blood thing as a positive or negative feature. See, Buffy’s slayer is most probably vampire, as the vampire species is capable of taking on flesh or finding the means of feeding itself through flesh, which also gives “spirit” of whatever form the means to have an effect on matter, why Buffy is “the HAND.” (Sometimes open and inviting, or merciful and tender; sometimes closed, like the introvert or the fist).

Further, Buffy did taste vampire blood: Dracula’s “dead” blood. Eww, of course, is her reaction. Why that is IS indeed fan fic. And probably where you are determining the shape of your story. Is the revulsion emotional because she does really taste “death” or the “darkness” of the vampire spirit recognizing something in common with itself MEANING HER or a part of her? (She is always struggling with this balance, or she wouldn’t have “picked” a vampire as her own “common denominator” AND one who ALSO has the daemon or “demon” called a SOUL—BOTH ARE DAEMON. UNLESS YOU wish to give the nature of SOUL the idea of unique identity of a person. . Daemon (demon) means spirit. It does not have to be good or bad, in fact.


Angelus is a kind of “possessed” and dead Liam, that I once thought gave ANIMA or animation to flesh, under the “old” rules, but then “possession” by a soul has to be the counterpart, which is what season 9 is trying to show, I think, and BOTH the demon and the soul spirits require ANIMA to “move” the flesh. ANIMA is now the ‘weak link’ in this cosmology of “zompire.” that comes from BEYOND this dimension and “somehow” “operates” in a world WITHOU magic—how does daemon “get in there?” and “jump start” the ANIMA or cause the daemon to “attach” without magic?—and MAYBE the comic says the “other dimensional” demon is having a “remote control effect” on a body, beyond this dimension, and therefore on the ANIMA of the body. Or somehow, these demons are in some version of the aether, like old myths, but mostly there is no explanation now of what ANIMA is.

Maybe she had a subconscious recogition of the craving to “take life” in flesh (the blood)—and an emotional, dark need to kill, not only for survival, but for the lust in the power of it; and maybe she felt the vampire spirit (the need to experience life, experience full scope of all of its colors, in full measure, even as the “fire goes out.” Or merely the coppery nature of blood and some unconscious taboo regarding cannibalism?

The curiosity of the human being is a combination of the drive for survival, the desire for experience, and for experience to enable the human to grow aka transcend its current condition in someway, including understanding.

As for magic. In full disclosure of POV, I’m Wicca, but NOT a version of polytheism “outside” the self; more closely like a Buddhist view—what you saw in season 8 in the 7 energy cakras to “twilight,”—but nature itself brought me to value paradox and “unity of opposites,” so the nature of magic, to me, is absolutely like the process of science, but MAKES the process, even in the processes of changing one’s understanding of the self. Kinda like trying to explain what gravity IS, not how it acts. Yet magic itself is where science fails, and not because of some current “ignorance;” but simply because the nature of the “physical” (I think therefore I am) in thought and shaped by word is not the most “fundamental element” to me.

I consider everything coming from nothing: Love. This is not some weepy, sentimental, romantic force. It’s about “potential” retained in “death.” It’s fierce and it’s so sublimely balanced, we are yet to learn/know even 85% of the “stuffness” of our own universe and are pretty much at the beginnings in the more we learn.

Motion or energy might be more “fundamental” than is “word” and we all know that matter and energy are “the same thing.” Bottom Line: Science can describe, but cannot say what anything IS. We do not know what consciousness itself is. This is where the drive of a human being to understand what consciousness is, where it comes from is given “explanation” or “epiphany” that God therefore exists. Myths and religion are common sources linking this singularly human and common connection between all humans, whatever culture, whatever timeframe, whatever divergence from this “common need” to comprehend “the self,” or “everything.”


Maybe the vampire spirit attaches to the “dead brain” and attaches only to the strongest desires, the primal desires, of fear, pain, appetite for food, drink, sex. This are often called evil, but evil to me, is simply not caring, no empathy, a conscious that is not retrained with any consideration for the well being of another, NOT desire itself, which Joss seems to call “demons” and “evil,” enables life to sustain itself, which does KILL TO LIVE, no matter the form. This is Joss’s central tenet that life is tragic.

The physical “flesh” is really about “blood” as this substance “moves” and, like the eternal river that is never the same river, yet also is the same river,” which carries the “experience” of living human beings and this is important: direct experience. Vampires can’t have direct experience---it is all “reflection” because the brains of their hosts are dead, their flesh is dead, so they crave (mind) that which “feeds” the spirit since vampire is a demon spirit. It is the spirit species capable of “taking on flesh”.

I believe that vampires feed on human blood because of the old idea of blood as “the life force” carried through out the body and, therefore, the direct experience of a living human being (Even though living human beings wrangle with the information/stimulation “outside” their bodies and “inside” their bodies, through the brain to “make sense” of this information against the backdrop of consciousness (mind: the direct experiencer) itself aka a type of “reflection” itself aka “story”).

Vampires are capable of learning new “survival techniques” and the vampire Angelus “accepted” the “pain” of “waiting” for a greater end result in the level of pain, fear, revulsion, etc in his victims: like “fine wine.” He was able to ascertain degrees of the primal fear in hate, anger, defeat. Angel did not speak of the great goodness of Buffy’s love in her blood, which actually, for a Catholic, would most probably be a supreme or supernatural power aka her MERCY which he most certainly called the greatest power there is.

I do think the vampire spirit of Dracula found her vampire spirit in her blood that gives her supernatural “drives” of the body, in that small taste-experience, since the vampire spirit specifically seeks to possess flesh, in order to have that which feeds its spirit best. I do imagine vampire spirit could inhabit other animals, but I rather doubt a vampire would sire an animal, even by accident of animal bite, when so many humans are around, without natural weapons, and with greater suffering, SIMPLY because of the awareness of the duality of good and evil, which is not quite the same as right and wrong. (Learning).

Did that help? Well, you probably know better what you DON’T think! Ha!
HUGS!
sybil
p.s. Good Luck! Where ya gonna post your story when you do write it?
Thanks in advance for letting us all know!
p.p.s. I wasn't clear on one point. I thought the demon or the soul WERE Anima, but that is not what Joss is going for. Anima actually is the thrust or force to JOIN. (Not just hormonal testosterone). Pretty darn neat, actually whatever drives the human to the risky nature of "other" or even to "return to god."
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The Librarian
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PostPosted: Tue Dec 13, 2011 4:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
Of course, to really be able to judge the merits of my idea, you'd have to read at least a bit of my story. Cause it's always ultimately the matter of how, and not the what when it comes to writing. But the story is so long, and I'm not sure how to present this one thing efectively without telling the whole story or even worse, taking the thing out of context and giving you just the parts that directly deal with the issue.


Toybox is about a lot more than prompts. It's also a place where you can ask for help or for a beta. Elsewhere, a few of us have started to talk about what a beta should actually do, but one thing, I think, is to help you with comments on bits of your story that you are worried about.

Or, you could use the Writers' Workshop on this board.

It sounds like a mammoth undertaking, and I'm sure your ideas are really interesting. But I do understand your reluctance to post the whole thing, or parts of it, publicly until you are satisfied. So, a private exchange with one or more people who are willing to comment on some of the ideas might be a way forward.

What do you think?

Jo
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MaryZg
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PostPosted: Tue Dec 13, 2011 4:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

sybil, so you see Buffy's inner demon as being the same as the vampire demon? I'm not alone in this? The principle of fight fire with fire maybe drove those Shadow Men to force the demon into a girl?

I've taken this to be the very reason why a ritual instigated on the instinctual level in a vampire would succeed in making the Slayer a vampire's mate. The whole idea works fine as the means to show how really complementing they are to each other, how equal and perfect they are for each other.
This of course enables me to speak of even Angelus' love for her - after all, it's the demon that reacts to her blood instinctually. I even dared to explain Angel's leaving her because of this - his demon was obsessing over her before the bite happened, but after it it could only get worse. She wasn't so despicably other to him anymore, no good to his evil, not even the same but opposite force, but quite literally his mate.

And that "love" is not "a choir of little birdies" type of affair - it's a drive, a force one can't understand, but can only live or die by it.

Sorry for focusing merely on that single point of your post, but it's important to me Smile

There's just one little problem with the whole idea: if it's a vampire demon inside Buffy, why does it turn on its own? Why are vampires and slayers natural enemies?
Another idea occured to me while writing this. Maybe in answering this, we could also answer why there's the "vampire" in her title in the first place...
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MaryZg
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PostPosted: Tue Dec 13, 2011 5:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

[quote="The Librarian"]
Quote:
It sounds like a mammoth undertaking, and I'm sure your ideas are really interesting. But I do understand your reluctance to post the whole thing, or parts of it, publicly until you are satisfied. So, a private exchange with one or more people who are willing to comment on some of the ideas might be a way forward.

What do you think?

Jo


Oh... I tried to find a beta on FFN, but that didn't really work out. The girl was supposed to help me primarily with my language, since English isn't my first language, and while I've written stuff in English before, it wasn't exactly fiction, so I was worried about that.

I'd be very grateful to anyone who'd be willing to take a look at my story. And if it were you, Jo, I'd be thrilled Smile I really appreciate your writing.

It's really humbling to write in this fandom. It's so huge, and well established, and I'm such a latecomer into it that I'm frightened to even consider publishing anything. It took me ages to even post a reply on this forum for instance.
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sybil
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PostPosted: Tue Dec 13, 2011 8:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
There's just one little problem with the whole idea: if it's a vampire demon inside Buffy, why does it turn on its own? Why are vampires and slayers natural enemies?
MARYZg

You are speaking of mate as "like with like" and that is very much part of the Buffy and Angel stories, both beginning with the betrayals of father, the journeys of the dark night of the soul, and the salvation of both through love.

Angel answers that question himself. When he was speaking of being cursed, how he went from centuries of darkness, death--evil--to suddenly having to care: the soul. "You don't know what it's like to suddenly care."

It is the soul that so many think Buffy considered in NOT killing Angel, as the single reason for "giving him mercy, the second chance." However, she spared his life, when he kissed her--their first physical/spiritual "union of opposites;" and he lost control of his "true face" emerging. She found her slayer instincts awakened, against her human heart. She was right on his heels to kill him, and to fight the hurt of being so uniformly "fallen" and afaid of being tricked by "the face of an Angel" and the words he forgets the next morning, (as Liam had done to use women), when she had before knocked him on his back, NOT fooled by the face of an Angel, but given the one talisman AGAINST vampires. (Silver is "the goddess" moon, a symbol of Buffy, and the cross is not just Christian, but the "crossroads” e.g. life/death, good/evil)

Anyway, Angel showed he was a vampire, NOT that he had a soul. (It all could have been a trick; and Angelus took ADVANTAGE of that FEAR later on after consummation of their marriage--yes, Angel is stronger because he cares, because it is harder to care and choose good, not just "guess the right choice,” and because it requires will, (to want) and because it is Buffy.

Buffy showed she was a slayer, the “demon” or “daemon” light of god, as it were, which is given the human being, just after the breath of life, according to Genesis in King James version of the Bible for those who connect “soul” to “God” as would Angel. HOWEVER she also sent the bolt wide: she was also human and her soul mate, not just a heterosexual opposite in flesh, not just the spiritual kin of “vampire demon” stood before her, ALSO in recognition of itself.

Further, Angel KILLED both the mother and father figure DARLA, so there is no OEDIPAL or IMMATURE relationship going on here. This is the proof. He is now ready for love of "the other." (He has the spiritual love, and they are “rebelling” against the order of the day, the rules of slayers killing vampires, in the chivalrous code, and are now ready for their freedom, fully expressed, one within the other, as spiritual union and the union of the flesh, as is ordained by God, in vows of body and spirit in marriage. And sacrifice is already part of their legend. Her friends think a vampire and a slayer "doesn't work."

Angel also has an iron will in order to bear the weight of his past and all the moments and crimes of "not caring," ot to mention the he has to carry the great loss of every bit of happiness he ever knew, both good and evil. Further, Angel is not a "plaster saint," like they made Spike. Giles pointed out the extraordinary CHARACTER it would take for a being enduring hell fo centuries; imagine if that being ALSO had a soul? The aloneness, the horror, the fear, the perfection of God in all its opposition inflicted upon it. That is why it is called the all consuming, eternal fire, when Angel's soul is the light or fire that ILLUMINATES all darkness.

He wears a near inpenetrable mask, to hide his pain, as does the ancient Eastern warrior, not tip his hand as part of strategic power; and the mind of the man encompasses "it all," but it is his heart, held before him, (as he once told Buffy about hers) that always spells "Buffy," that reveals his great and yet, deeply human soul.

“Like with Like” was given to Spike to equal "friendship" and, since Buffy and Angel are lovers, they are designated now as "never being friends." Please notice that light hair and dark hair are Opposites, and blonde with blonde or brunette with brunette are “like with like.” Joss tends to “link” those with light brown hair with a darker blond type hair as “human” and “mature.” Anyway, utter nonsense.

We saw Buffy comfortable to share her life with him in the beginning, it is her desire for their future. The inclusion of Spike did NOT expand the universe, it just gave the mythology's a “twin” foil, which actually FAILED, as it just created shame and, for me, the shame of it all lies here for ALL of the Buffy verse. Buffy had nothing to be ashamed of up until season sex.

It lost all it’s charm and became about depression of blame/shame and self-hate vs self worth. SHAME is NOT the darkness; and the “darkness” is not evil; and “humanity” doesn't mean something gushy and sentimental or tragic. It can also be pretty darn evil.


HUGS!
sybil
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The Librarian
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PostPosted: Wed Dec 14, 2011 12:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
I'd be very grateful to anyone who'd be willing to take a look at my story. And if it were you, Jo, I'd be thrilled I really appreciate your writing.


I've got so much on at the moment that I don't know which way is up. But how can I resist?

I can't take on a big project (and 140,000 words is a huge project), but maybe I can get the ball rolling a bit.

Would you like to send me, to begin with, a summary of the main points you're worried about, the rationale behind them, the evidence you've based them on, and why you're worried? I didn't say there wouldn't be homework! Wink

Have you got my email address?

By the way, if English isn't your first language, you're doing pretty well!

Jo
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MaryZg
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PostPosted: Thu Dec 15, 2011 9:01 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Jo,
Homework, huh? Fortunately, I love doing homework. Or I used to, when I still attended schools.
Okay, then. I'll have to put something together and send it to you as soon as I'm ready.

And, thank you! I can't express how much, since it will be amazing to finally exchange some thoughts on this with someone as invested into the whole thing (I mean, into writing B/A fiction) as you are. I hold you as a sort of an expert on Angel/us. Or was it demons in general?
Email would be the same as is on your site, the yahoo account?

Now onto sybil. So many things, I don't know where to begin!
Okay, let's start with that damn soul business. (On a sidenote: I'm beyond atheist, meaning I can't even hear the word soul in RL and keep my face straight. So you can see how ironic it is for me to have to deal with this issue...)

A soul. In my own language (a Slavic tongue of Southern persuasion) it's called "duša" and it comes from the verb for "breathing" and is connected to the ancient noun for "breath", "duh". This noun is a part of the phrase for Holy Spirit (Duh Sveti) in modern day Croatian, and is also a word for "ghost". So I can't actually comprehend how a "daemon" would be different from "spirit" since my own language irons them out into a single meaning. God has created the man (and a woman, and don't even get me started on that!) and given him life. i.e. breath, meaning "spirit" and/or "soul". It's what *animates* - the breath of God. Like Liam, I was born Catholic, though it didn't last me all that long. Were it not for B/A, I don't think I'd given the subject of souls any further thought ever in my life. But confronted with Angel and encouraged by my own traditions, I've decided that to best deal with Angel and his animae, I'd iron them out too. They're quite the same to me, his demon and his soul, in their function. That's where the similarities end, though, and where I have to accept the theology and it's dogmas about undying souls and what not.

What makes Angel and Buffy perfect mates isn't only that they are opposites that attract, but that both of them have the same split introduced into them by the encroaching animae (a demon in her case, and a soul in his). They're complementary, they fit into each other like Legos do. Both are "unique" in this respect. There's no other like them, beyond their pair. I've always imagined them as *having the potential to become the same*, but travelling from the opposite directions. In this journey of theirs (and journey or road is imo the best metaphor for their love), in their various meetings and partings, they are able to create the whole spectrum of "colors" of life (and life is the breath of God, or Spirit, or Soul), the entire universe of love as it were. In this sense, they are very mythical indeed.

So the metaphors of "demon" and "soul" work really well to show the mutual-ness of their destinies. And thus I have accepted those terms as tools. Doesn't mean I don't shudder using them...
There's that term "soulmates", too. Of course they're that too. But, honestly, I really don't know how to *write* that? The physiological aspect of the instinctual, animalistic mating I can narrate and describe (just as science can, and that is *big* imo - I'm a scientist by conviction and love of truth and fact). This soulmates gig - not my thing in the least. I believe I'd react along the same lines Angelus would if someone would mention him this word. Can you imagine? Almost endless mocking. Of course, he'd finish it off on a bloody note soon enough, while I really don't want to offend anyone.
But really! What would that imply, speaking from the persepcive of the narrative exposition of the idea of soulmates? Their souls ache for one another and when they are apart, they hurt? Where is the seat of the soul? Where does it hurt and how would they recognize it? Is the soul inside of the body, like water is inside of a glass or a pot? Or is the body the seat of the soul, its temple? If it's the seat, then I don't see any difference between body and soul, and the physical is the spiritual, and the soul mating *is* the animal mating (especially since "anima" is the spirit or the soul, "duša").

Of course I understand the terms and symbols (and myths they originate in) you're talking about here. Or at least, I know of them, even if I don't even hope to understand them or acept their truths, beyond their historical and sociological value.
But the defining framework in Joss-verse is Christian, and the whole idea of vampires he leans on comes from the Christian mythology, and Angel is a particular problem precisely *for* the Christian mythology. And in this mythology (which of course can never ever hide its pagan origins and deceptions) the main issue is the *human* as differing from "animal", human as an image of the divine ("i stvori ga na sliku svoju, muško i žensko stori ih"; roughly translated: "and he (God) created him/them in his image, the man and the woman" from Genesis). And in this scheme it's the God's spirit (duh, duša) that gives the right to the human to rule over the animal. And don't even get me started on that...
I want to crush this pretty picture and stomp on it until it is dust, like Buffy did with Master's bones. Because this "human" is only here to show us that none of us, except the saints, can never ever be deserving of God's rewards (return to Eden), and it's effectievly reducing us down to the animalistic level of sinning (and at one time they expected us to give them real money to buy our way back into the God's arms), and the "human" is only a dangling carrot in front of our lowly mortal eyes, bordering on angelic we'll almost certainly fail to achieve.
In my story, I aim to throw The Powers out on their asses from our Universe, together with this "human" idol of Christian mythology, and this aim has held a great therapeutic value for me during my writing.
Both Buffy and Angel are martyrs of this idolatry, both more and less than human in all respects. I'm using their energies to show that a human being has nothing more than itself and other humans to count on in this world, and I believe they give me plenty of reason to try to tell precisely that kind of story. He, coming from the "demon" side of the split, she from the "spirit" side, ending *together* but not in the dead middle of enthropy of the many shades of grey, or particularly not so in some sort of a static, white misted heaven/paradise, but as I said elsewhere, in the rainbow of colors of life - i.e. in the thick of the moral choice, right here on the bloody Earth. "What we do matters" and "fight is everyday".

Apologies for the confusing thoughts. Why do I always have the feeling of my head spinning of my neck after thinking about this?!

EDIT: And, of course the series lost its track in season sex (LOL), but I have a stubborn mind that knows where to close its eyes and overlook what is simply lame and wrong, and then navigate into less murky waters by undoing the damage done through writing a narrative of my own. Oh, the beauty of fan fiction!
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PostPosted: Thu Dec 15, 2011 10:02 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Mary

Yes, my address is the yahoo one. I look forward to getting your homework! Very Happy

Me? An expert on Angel/us? My goodness.... Cool

Sybil

You know, I love reading your ideas, and the enthusiasm behind them!

Very Happy

By the way, Dark Star has something happening shortly (I won't steal her thunder) for which I've provided a story that takes a look at souls, demons and Powers. It might be appropriate to this discussion, so watch this space. Or, well, maybe not this exact space. Maybe DS's portal page? I'm not sure...

Rolling Eyes

Jo
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MaryZg
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PostPosted: Thu Dec 15, 2011 10:20 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Jo, sure you are an expert on demons! I just re-read "Bringer of Light", so... It's frightening how much you know about Christianity. (Christianity is frightening in itself, too, so maybe I'm just frightened by it and not by your knowledge of it.)
Anyway, that homework has to get done, so I have to run off and do it.
*searches for her inner Willow...
And again, thanks Smile
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PostPosted: Sat Dec 17, 2011 8:15 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi Mary,

Thank you for your insight into another language (I love languages) yours, I believe, is Slavic? And this is very interesting...

Quote:
A soul. In my own language (a Slavic tongue of Southern persuasion) it's called "duša" and it comes from the verb for "breathing" and is connected to the ancient noun for "breath", "duh". This noun is a part of the phrase for Holy Spirit (Duh Sveti) in modern day Croatian, and is also a word for "ghost". So I can't actually comprehend how a "daemon" would be different from "spirit" since my own language irons them out into a single meaning. God has created the man (and a woman, and don't even get me started on that!) and given him life. i.e. breath, meaning "spirit" and/or "soul". It's what *animates* - the breath of God. Like Liam, I was born Catholic, though it didn't last me all that long. Were it not for B/A, I don't think I'd given the subject of souls any further thought ever in my life. But confronted with Angel and encouraged by my own traditions, I've decided that to best deal with Angel and his animae, I'd iron them out too. They're quite the same to me, his demon and his soul, in their function. That's where the similarities end, though, and where I have to accept the theology and it's dogmas about undying souls and what not.


"The breath of God' animates us, is our soul, our spirit.
Isn't language fascinating? I love how the origins of language can inspire and manifest itself in folklore, legend, and of course fanfiction.

Ares
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LittleRaven
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PostPosted: Sat Dec 17, 2011 5:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Fun facts regarding the soul in the English language, found entirely through shallow googling.

In the King James, the seventh verse of Genesis 2: 7 And the LORD God formed man of the dust of the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; and man became a living soul. 1 Cor. 15.45
http://www.bartleby.com/108/01/2.html

The Wikipedia entry says the English word http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Soul could have come from a practice of binding the dead to prevent their return as a ghost, so it would mean bound. Or an adaptation by missionaries of a native Germanic concept translated from the Greek psyche, which is "to cool, to blow." And that the word first appeared in Beowulf.

And the online etymology dictionary http://www.etymonline.com/index.php?search=soul+mate
http://www.etymonline.com/index.php?term=soul says:
Quote:
O.E. sawol "spiritual and emotional part of a person, animate existence," from P.Gmc. *saiwalo (cf. O.S. seola, O.N. sala, O.Fris. sele, M.Du. siele, Du. ziel, O.H.G. seula, Ger. Seele, Goth. saiwala), of uncertain origin. Sometimes said to mean originally "coming from or belonging to the sea," because that was supposed to be the stopping place of the soul before birth or after death. Hence, from P.Gmc. *saiwaz (see sea). Meaning "spirit of a deceased person" is attested in O.E. from 971. As a synonym for "person, individual" (e.g. every living soul) it dates from early 14c. Soul-searching (n.) is attested from 1948, from the phrase used as a pp. adj. (1610s).


Quote:
animus
1820, "temper" (usually in a hostile sense), from L. animus "rational soul, mind, life, mental powers; courage, desire," related to anima "living being, soul, mind, disposition, passion, courage, anger, spirit, feeling," from PIE base *ane- "to blow, to breathe" (cf. Gk. anemos "wind," Skt. aniti "breathes," O.Ir. anal, Welsh anadl "breath," O.Ir. animm "soul," Goth. uzanan "to exhale," O.N. anda "to breathe," O.E. eđian "to breathe," O.C.S. vonja "smell, breath," Arm. anjn "soul"). It has no plural. As a term in Jungian psychology for the masculine component of a feminine personality, it dates from 1923.


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